Channel Awesome is an absolutely godawful horror show
- Perrydotto
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Channel Awesome is an absolutely godawful horror show
NOTE: Due to this whole ordeal escalating pretty significantly, the thread has been moved to the Soapbox. There is discussion of some increasingly serious shit ahead, be warned.
Also, DO NOT visit the Channel Awesome forums for any reason, as there have been trolls posting severely messed up gore pictures. Don't tempt fate, don't try it.
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This warrants its own thread, methinks.
Channel Awesome is that place Doug Walker AKA the Nostalgia Critic started in order to host his videos and those of creators like Linkara, Spoony, Lindsay Ellis, Angry Joe, and others. Back in its hayday (geez, they started what, 10 years ago? how time flies) it was one of those few places outright catering to nerd video content in a big way (similiar to places like ScrewAttack). A lot of the "angry internet reviewer" craze was started and cultivated there. Things were exciting since Youtube wasn't a great place to host these kinda things (Blip.TV was used until it went under) and good production values kinda took a backseat to the raw energy the producers had. Basically, it was a simpler time where a lot of folks online were teenagers and found it exciting to see video content online made by people like them for people like them.
Now several of Channel Awesome's former creators have come forward to discuss their grievances with the site, particularly the management and behind the scenes bullshit they were subject to. The impression of the silly happy bunch of folks making videos together wasn't all that accurate - A lot of the creators were friends with each other, but not friends with the management at all. There was a host of terrible shit that went down, from firing people for the pettiest reasons over triviliazing abuse and misogyny to generally being utterly incompetent at managing a site and its creators. The whole ordeal is sobering to say the least, and a huge example of how not to go about leading your indie business, especially not after you hit it big and people rightfully expect some kind of competence from you.
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(WARNING: Some of the issues discussed in the document revolve around things such as sexism, sexual abuse, rape jokes and some generally fucked up behaviour. Proceed with caution)
The Full Document: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WZF ... mxroimnosh
The Summarized Version: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1d7U ... Uo/preview#
The documents are being accessed a lot at the moment, so if you have issues loading them, that might be why.
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Channel Awesome, who usually sit public drama out, already made this non-apology on their Twitter:
Fun times.
Also, DO NOT visit the Channel Awesome forums for any reason, as there have been trolls posting severely messed up gore pictures. Don't tempt fate, don't try it.
-----------------------
This warrants its own thread, methinks.
Channel Awesome is that place Doug Walker AKA the Nostalgia Critic started in order to host his videos and those of creators like Linkara, Spoony, Lindsay Ellis, Angry Joe, and others. Back in its hayday (geez, they started what, 10 years ago? how time flies) it was one of those few places outright catering to nerd video content in a big way (similiar to places like ScrewAttack). A lot of the "angry internet reviewer" craze was started and cultivated there. Things were exciting since Youtube wasn't a great place to host these kinda things (Blip.TV was used until it went under) and good production values kinda took a backseat to the raw energy the producers had. Basically, it was a simpler time where a lot of folks online were teenagers and found it exciting to see video content online made by people like them for people like them.
Now several of Channel Awesome's former creators have come forward to discuss their grievances with the site, particularly the management and behind the scenes bullshit they were subject to. The impression of the silly happy bunch of folks making videos together wasn't all that accurate - A lot of the creators were friends with each other, but not friends with the management at all. There was a host of terrible shit that went down, from firing people for the pettiest reasons over triviliazing abuse and misogyny to generally being utterly incompetent at managing a site and its creators. The whole ordeal is sobering to say the least, and a huge example of how not to go about leading your indie business, especially not after you hit it big and people rightfully expect some kind of competence from you.
-------------------
(WARNING: Some of the issues discussed in the document revolve around things such as sexism, sexual abuse, rape jokes and some generally fucked up behaviour. Proceed with caution)
The Full Document: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WZF ... mxroimnosh
The Summarized Version: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1d7U ... Uo/preview#
The documents are being accessed a lot at the moment, so if you have issues loading them, that might be why.
-----------------------
Channel Awesome, who usually sit public drama out, already made this non-apology on their Twitter:
Fun times.
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- Aria Genisi
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Like, there's non-apologies, but then there's the line "we're sorry you felt that way" that makes me go all in record time
- Mr. Big
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I'm amazed that Doug doesn't own the copyright to the Nostalgia Critic, apparently having signed it over to Michaud. Like, wow.
Ironic that he made fun of "The Room", given some of the stuff written about the making of the anniversary special feels like it came straight out of "The Disaster Artist".
Ironic that he made fun of "The Room", given some of the stuff written about the making of the anniversary special feels like it came straight out of "The Disaster Artist".
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
That was a read alright.
- West Filly
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I read the thread before starting to read the document. Working my way through the document now, every time one of the grievances is detailed all I hear is "We sincerely regret you felt that way"
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I never watched any of their content or really even heard of them before now
- West Filly
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
They're a bit too cheesey for my tastes but what I'd often do is find the bad movies they'd reviewed for inspiration on which bad movies would be good for a bad movie night.
- ToastGhost
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
More like Channel Awful am I right???
Seriously though, fuck them.
Seriously though, fuck them.
- West Filly
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I want to be down with the whole thing of wearing silly costumes and doing silly voices but I can't bring myself not to cringe or want to say "get on with the thing you're supposed to be talking about"
which is completely beside the whole point that their employers were shitty. Or maybe not? I have to wonder now how much of the stuff that I felt was out of place was down to them being creatively stifled by their management?
which is completely beside the whole point that their employers were shitty. Or maybe not? I have to wonder now how much of the stuff that I felt was out of place was down to them being creatively stifled by their management?
Last edited by West Filly on Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Perrydotto
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
A lot of the former Channel Awesome contributors have gone on to improve their craft and really make good shit on their own
I especially recommend you check out Lindsay Ellis, she is very insightful, fun and awesome: https://www.youtube.com/user/chezapoctu ... _polymer=1
I especially recommend you check out Lindsay Ellis, she is very insightful, fun and awesome: https://www.youtube.com/user/chezapoctu ... _polymer=1
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- The Doctor
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
She has been on an absolute roll recently with her videos. She's currently doing a look back at The Hobbit trilogy, and her most recent video on it had an interview with an actor who played one of the Dwarves.Perrydotto wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:00 pmA lot of the former Channel Awesome contributors have gone on to improve their craft and really make good shit on their own
I especially recommend you check out Lindsay Ellis, she is very insightful, fun and awesome: https://www.youtube.com/user/chezapoctu ... _polymer=1
- Mr. Big
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
The part with the tribute to Jewwario is especially aggravating. Like wow, Michaud is a sociopath.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I discovered Lindsay recently (with her Bright essay), and while I’m enjoying her earlier stuff as Nostalgia Chick, it hasn’t inspired me to explore the rest of CA. And maybe that’s just as well?Perrydotto wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:00 pmA lot of the former Channel Awesome contributors have gone on to improve their craft and really make good shit on their own
I especially recommend you check out Lindsay Ellis, she is very insightful, fun and awesome: https://www.youtube.com/user/chezapoctu ... _polymer=1
- Auxiliatrix
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Some of the really screwed-up bits were quite painful to read.
The ex-contributors are owed more than a non-apology, but I'm not sure if Channel Awesome is going to give it to them.
The ex-contributors are owed more than a non-apology, but I'm not sure if Channel Awesome is going to give it to them.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
It's definitely not going to happen. Admitting liability exposes someone to legal risk. Also, it's psychologically uncomfortable to the individual delivering the apology, particularly if they'd have to be sincere in becoming aware of themselves as a perpetrator of persistent and lengthy distress to others. Can you imagine suddenly being aware that you personally had caused this? When said individual is clearly self centered, it's the only person whose psychological discomfort would have any bearing on whether this awareness or apology happens. It won't happen, not this side of any court cases at least.
- Mr. Big
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
And now I suddenly realize why it's rare to hear genuine apology from public figures (aside from the other thing you mentioned). I wouldn't be surprised if most public apologies are written by their lawyers.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Some countries (including parts of Canada, unsurprisingly) have laws which forbid the use of an apology as an admission of liability in legal cases. It's a practical idea because if even one apology defuses a situation before lawyers get involved, then that has saved a whole world of trouble.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
And I won't let go of the other point in what I said. You won't believe the kind of mental gymnastics people will unconsciously perform in order to protect themselves from becoming consciously aware of uncomfortable truths. "I have persistently caused discomfort to many people over a prolonged period of time" is something a person's mind might want to protect themselves from actually realising. It's part of the reason why assholes often get worse and crazier before showing any remorse: the closer they are to being cornered by the thing they're avoiding, the more desperate the attempts to avoid the truth become.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I don't think a person who's capable of the kind of shit Michaud has pulled could ever be sorry, anyway.
Every jumbled pile of person has a thinking part that wonders what the part that isn't thinking isn't thinking of...
- Perrydotto
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
if said person is the kinda guy to tell someone not to honor their friend because "you don't get enough views, loser", then yeah I agree.
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- Perrydotto
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
With permission, Daily Dot did a writeup on the situation
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- Auxiliatrix
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I hope this doesn't quietly go away until some sort of change happens, whatever that may be. We've already seen a few producers leave Channel Awesome, but I'm not sure if anything will go further than that.
The increased attention (such as the article you posted above) definitely helps.
The increased attention (such as the article you posted above) definitely helps.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Apparently since the document was made public, about 10k people have unsubscribed from Channel Awesome on Youtube. No idea if that will mean anything to them, but it's a thing
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- West Filly
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
There should be a special youtube play button made of compacted and polished poop just for channels that tank after a PR disaster.
- Auxiliatrix
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Mail them a statue of the YouTube pause button.West Filly wrote: ↑Thu Apr 05, 2018 5:29 pmThere should be a special youtube play button made of compacted and polished poop just for channels that tank after a PR disaster.
Channels that show steps towards redemption get mailed a YouTube buffering symbol.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
They send you a plaque of the Youtube "Play" logo when you reach a certain number of subscribers, so maybe crashing and burning could be the Youtube ":-/" logo.Auxiliatrix wrote: ↑Thu Apr 05, 2018 6:53 pmMail them a statue of the YouTube pause button.
Channels that show steps towards redemption get mailed a YouTube buffering symbol.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
And yet he continues to associate with them.
It's getting harder and harder to avoid the temptation to get on his case about it.
Every jumbled pile of person has a thinking part that wonders what the part that isn't thinking isn't thinking of...
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Most of the producers who continue to associate with Channel Awesome, excluding Chris Stuckmann (who recently spoke out on Twitter about the situation), appear to be mostly quiet, so the fact that he's talking about it in general is surprising to me.
Right now, I can't see much benefit being provided to those who stay with Channel Awesome. Heck, it seemed like there wasn't much benefit before all of this anyway.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
That's the first time I've ever heard Tony Goldmark described as "mostly quiet".
There was a benefit to being associated with Doug Walker, who was one of the most famous Internet personalities for years. (Or so it seemed at the time; these days the "most famous" YouTubers seem to be people I would never even hear of until they got outed as Nazis or something.) It meant exposure, and sometimes lots of it, at a time when that was about the most anyone could hope to get out of video content. In the days when Blip.tv offered not only sanctuary from the looming specter of copyright bots but a way to monetize views at the same time, you were pretty much either on somebody's website or you weren't anywhere, because Blip was little more than a host for embedded videos.
Granted, the nature of Tony's content (mostly shots of himself talking on location intercut with ride footage videos he got on YouTube and long-lost TV specials) made him more immune to the copyright bots than most, as evidenced when Blip was shut down and he had to migrate to YouTube with the rest of them. And the Channel Awesome website has gotten worse and worse lately. (It's now impossible to actually scroll to the comments section because the page automatically spawns more ads in between, forever. There's a special place in hell for whoever thought that one up.) But he did get a pretty big bump lately from his guest spot on Doug's Sorceror's Apprentice episode.
Even now, though YouTube is such a huge place that getting noticed is practically impossible unless you have connections. I'm kind of hoping most of the former Channel Awesome people plan on banding together and revive the Chez Apocalypse spinoff site, complete with a way for promising up-and-comers to apply for affiliation.
There was a benefit to being associated with Doug Walker, who was one of the most famous Internet personalities for years. (Or so it seemed at the time; these days the "most famous" YouTubers seem to be people I would never even hear of until they got outed as Nazis or something.) It meant exposure, and sometimes lots of it, at a time when that was about the most anyone could hope to get out of video content. In the days when Blip.tv offered not only sanctuary from the looming specter of copyright bots but a way to monetize views at the same time, you were pretty much either on somebody's website or you weren't anywhere, because Blip was little more than a host for embedded videos.
Granted, the nature of Tony's content (mostly shots of himself talking on location intercut with ride footage videos he got on YouTube and long-lost TV specials) made him more immune to the copyright bots than most, as evidenced when Blip was shut down and he had to migrate to YouTube with the rest of them. And the Channel Awesome website has gotten worse and worse lately. (It's now impossible to actually scroll to the comments section because the page automatically spawns more ads in between, forever. There's a special place in hell for whoever thought that one up.) But he did get a pretty big bump lately from his guest spot on Doug's Sorceror's Apprentice episode.
Even now, though YouTube is such a huge place that getting noticed is practically impossible unless you have connections. I'm kind of hoping most of the former Channel Awesome people plan on banding together and revive the Chez Apocalypse spinoff site, complete with a way for promising up-and-comers to apply for affiliation.
Every jumbled pile of person has a thinking part that wonders what the part that isn't thinking isn't thinking of...
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Has anyone said "more like Channel Awful" yet?
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
More like Chunder Barfsome
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
A slew of people are leaving CA now, it's basically like dominoes
Chris Stuckmann left, old time friend of the Walkers Last Angry Geek left, Nast left and more, it's a full-on sinking ship now I suppose
Chris Stuckmann left, old time friend of the Walkers Last Angry Geek left, Nast left and more, it's a full-on sinking ship now I suppose
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- Perrydotto
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Also be careful in case you are looking at Twitter for more on this, some assholes are trying to frame it as a "Gamergate success" simply because Folding Ideas guy Dan Olson used to be on CA and has been a target of the Kotaku in Action crowd for a while
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Tony quit today too. Is there literally anyone left besides Doug, Brad, and Angry Joe?
Every jumbled pile of person has a thinking part that wonders what the part that isn't thinking isn't thinking of...
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
Long thread.
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
I'm not shocked that whatever plans they had for another anniversary are being killed.
(Read the bit in parentheses at the very end.)
(Read the bit in parentheses at the very end.)
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- The Doctor
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Re: Channel Awesome is a massive shitshow
"Know what would help this whole thing blow over? Another terrible response!"
http://channelawesome.com/our-response/
And we're totally not a misogynistic place. That's why our response only names women.
http://channelawesome.com/our-response/
And we're totally not a misogynistic place. That's why our response only names women.
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